The Middle East explained (late 2015 edition) or how USA became the bad guys...

[WadeFillingame]

In case you don't know what's happening in the middle east.  :boty:


President Assad ( who is bad ) is a nasty guy who got so nasty his people rebelled and the Rebels ( who are good ) started winning ( Hurrah!).
But then some of the rebels turned a bit nasty and are now called Islamic State ( who are definitely bad!) and some continued to support democracy ( who are still good.)

So the Americans ( who are good ) started bombing Islamic State ( who are bad ) and giving arms to the Syrian Rebels ( who are good ) so they could fight Assad ( who is still bad ) which was good.
By the way, there is a breakaway state in the north run by the Kurds who want to fight IS ( which is a good thing ) but the Turkish authorities think they are bad, so we have to say they are bad whilst secretly thinking they're good and giving them guns to fight IS (which is good) but that is another matter.

Getting back to Syria.
So President Putin ( who is bad, cos he invaded Crimea and the Ukraine and killed lots of folks including that nice Russian man in London with polonium poisoned sushi ) has decided to back Assad ( who is still bad ) by attacking IS ( who are also bad ) which is sort of a good thing?

But Putin ( still bad ) thinks the Syrian Rebels ( who are good ) are also bad, and so he bombs them too, much to the annoyance of the Americans ( who are good ) who are busy backing and arming the rebels ( who are also good).
Now Iran ( who used to be bad, but now they have agreed not to build any nuclear weapons and bomb Israel are now good ) are going to provide ground troops to support Assad ( still bad ) as are the Russians ( bad ) who now have ground troops and aircraft in Syria.

So a Coalition of Assad ( still bad ) Putin ( extra bad ) and the Iranians ( good, but in a bad sort of way ) are going to attack IS ( who are bad ) which is a good thing, but also the Syrian Rebels ( who are good ) which is bad.

Now the British ( obviously good, except that nice Mr Corbyn in the corduroy jacket, who is probably bad ) and the Americans ( also good ) cannot attack Assad ( still bad ) for fear of upsetting Putin ( bad ) and Iran ( good / bad) and now they have to accept that Assad might not be that bad after all compared to IS ( who are super bad).

So Assad ( bad ) is now probably good, being better than IS ( but let’s face it, drinking your own wee is better than IS so no real choice there ) and since Putin and Iran are also fighting IS that may now make them Good. America ( still Good ) will find it hard to arm a group of rebels being attacked by the Russians for fear of upsetting Mr Putin ( now good ) and that nice mad Ayatollah in Iran ( also Good ) and so they may be forced to say that the Rebels are now Bad, or at the very least abandon them to their fate. This will lead most of them to flee to Turkey and on to Europe or join IS ( still the only constantly bad group).

To Sunni Muslims, an attack by Shia Muslims ( Assad and Iran ) backed by Russians will be seen as something of a Holy War, and the ranks of IS will now be seen by the Sunnis as the only Jihadis fighting in the Holy War and hence many Muslims will now see IS as Good ( Doh!.)

Sunni Muslims will also see the lack of action by Britain and America in support of their Sunni rebel brothers as something of a betrayal ( mmm.might have a point.) and hence we will be seen as Bad.

So now we have America ( now bad ) and Britain ( also bad ) providing limited support to Sunni Rebels ( bad ) many of whom are looking to IS ( Good / bad ) for support against Assad ( now good ) who, along with Iran ( also Good) and Putin ( also, now, unbelievably, Good ) are attempting to retake the country Assad used to run before all this started?

So, now you fully understand everything, all your questions are answered!!!!

[Hutch]

Pretty fucking accurate, and, despite the seriousness of the situation, quite amusingly written. Thanks !! I seriously now do know more than I did.

Awaiting the second installment..... on the Turks and Kurds.

[TimO]

Yah Wade, except you got it all wrong.... well done. What you said is what the typical American sheep is brainwashed with. I am a Vet but I am tired of our government's lies... enough is enough.

We want to topple Assad for one reason.... pass the natural gas pipeline from Qatar to Europe through Turkey..... anddddd.... end their dependance on Russian gas. Assad became is bad because we say it. He was elected by his people and he used to protect Christians in Syria so I'm not sure how he's bad.... oh I know.... because he doesn't want to bend over. Putin got in the game to make sure of 2 things.... make sure Europe and Turkey keep buying Russian gas and prevent IS from gathering at its order... like its happening now in Crimea [which BTW belongs to Russia and not Ukraine]. We supposedly kept bombing IS for a year but they kept multiplying...seriously?? Putin kills IS..... how is he bad? Because he got in the way of the west's objective.

Just before the shit hit Syria... we bombed Lybia, took the guns and sent them to "rebels" [people in Syria against Assad].... remember Benghazi?.... IS [funded by our people beheading terrorist Wahhabi Saudi ally] appeared and serves the west's agenda.... is only in certain places, regions, countries and attacks ...on demand certain other people..... the US, Europe, Israel, Turkey and the Saudis are BIG TIME all in bed with IS... it's normal, they're behind it.

[hp123]

[quote author=TimO link=topic=36244.msg154094#msg154094 date=1449813479]
Yah Wade, except you got it all wrong.... well done. What you said is what the typical American sheep is brainwashed with. I am a Vet but I am tired of our government's lies... enough is enough.

We want to topple Assad for one reason.... pass the natural gas pipeline from Qatar to Europe through Turkey..... anddddd.... end their dependance on Russian gas. Assad became is bad because we say it. He was elected by his people and he used to protect Christians in Syria so I'm not sure how he's bad.... oh I know.... because he doesn't want to bend over. Putin got in the game to make sure of 2 things.... make sure Europe and Turkey keep buying Russian gas and prevent IS from gathering at its order... like its happening now in Crimea [which BTW belongs to Russia and not Ukraine]. We supposedly kept bombing IS for a year but they kept multiplying...seriously?? Putin kills IS..... how is he bad? Because he got in the way of the west's objective.

Just before the shit hit Syria... we bombed Lybia, took the guns and sent them to "rebels" [people in Syria against Assad].... remember Benghazi?.... IS [funded by our people beheading terrorist Wahhabi Saudi ally] appeared and serves the west's agenda.... is only in certain places, regions, countries and attacks ...on demand certain other people..... the US, Europe, Israel, Turkey and the Saudis are BIG TIME all in bed with IS... it's normal, they're behind it.
[/quote]

Can't believe I'm about to say this...

Completely agree with Tim. Surprised the pipeline hasn't been more talked about in the past couple years. The timeline happened very black & white, clear cut.

[TimO]

[quote author=hp123 link=topic=36244.msg154097#msg154097 date=1449815306]
Can't believe I'm about to say this...

Completely agree with Tim. Surprised the pipeline hasn't been more talked about in the past couple years. The timeline happened very black & white, clear cut.
[/quote]

Actually, I don't remember the pipeline being talked at all but don't be surprised.... the American people and the world are only told what they need to know. How would you react if our government told us... "ok boys and girls, we're going to invade Afghanistan to keep [s]an eye on[/s] control of the poppy fields&trade, the goodies underground and have a strategic position against the Ruskies... we're also going to make up some WMD lies, invade Iraq, steal their oil and make sure Sunnis prevail [Sunnis that made up ISIS later]... then we'll start something called "Arab Spring", then Lybia, then Syria".

It's a strange scenario but I guess anything goes.... the Assad family was always in good terms with the US and Israel....things unraveled after they [Syria] were kicked out of Lebanon in 2005... triggered by the assassination of the Lebanese PM [a Mossad job]. I heard and read that Assad did not want to comply with the idea of the Qatari pipeline [Syria was always an ally to Iran and Iran to Russia]. I guess it explains why they were kicked out of Lebanon and not long after, the present war started.

[Cohim]

This all makes my head hurt. Shell oil just built a huge LNG plant in Quitar. My brother in law was project manager for the plant. So it seems that big oil is behind all of this shit going on in the Middle East? Hmmmmm.... So in turn, big oil is the uber terrorist.

I'm going to call the Don and see what he thinks.  :bigup:

Ps: TimO might have found his nitch here. Politics, go figure.  ;D
      A brain is engaged behind that keyboard. Good job! :)

[forgop]

Here's a new idea...

Those dickheads have been fighting each other for thousands of years.  Who in the hell are we to take a side and think we are the moral police and fight a battle that has zero chance of being won all while we lose credibility around the world for meddling around the globe? 

Wash your hands of it and move on. 

[wabashcr]

Also worth noting Iran is interested in building its own pipeline through Syria.  They have huge natural gas reserves, and easing of sanctions means they can put it on the market now.  Obviously everyone involved has a significant interest in how the pipelines end up playing out.  That's what will ultimately finance this war.  But the battle lines are still clearly sectarian.  You have the Shiites of Iran, Syria and parts of Iraq, and then you have the Sunni Arabs that make up most of the rest of the region.  ISIS sucks, but I'm not sure an Iranian controlled Shia coalition will be much better in the long term.  None of the likely resolutions looks very appetizing.  

We (Americans) are caught trying to play both sides of the fence.  Our ties with Sunni Arabs have been a lot more profitable for us, and the Shias are in tight with the Russians.  But ISIS and the ideology it represents poses a much greater short-term security risk.  

[Cohim]

[quote author=forgop link=topic=36244.msg154114#msg154114 date=1449840266]
Here's a new idea...

Those dickheads have been fighting each other for thousands of years.  Who in the hell are we to take a side and think we are the moral police and fight a battle that has zero chance of being won all while we lose credibility around the world for meddling around the globe? 

Wash your hands of it and move on. 
[/quote][move][move] :clap: :bigup: :clap: :bigup: :clap: :bigup: :clap: :bigup: :clap: :bigup: :clap: :bigup: :clap: :bigup: :clap: :bigup:[/move][/move]


I agree with this with every cell in my body! Not saying yo stop trade, but their holy war they have been fighting since before Christ, should be their mess and not ours.

[TheGipper]

[quote author=TimO link=topic=36244.msg154099#msg154099 date=1449824832]
invade Iraq, steal their oil[/quote]

So many myths in what you wrote, but this one really takes the cake.

Through June 2010, the US put $2.05 billion into post-war oil infrastructure improvements in Iraq.  With nothing promised by the Iraqi Ministy of Oil in return.  And nothing received.  Nothing.

The Iraqi Ministry of Oil is selling oil rights to companies to develop oil fields inside Iraq.  Again, the word is "Selling".  The Iraq government doesn't have oil extraction expertise, so they sell the rights to companies that do.  On the open market, what is essentially an auction process.  Again, "auction" means "sold".  Not stolen.

More than half the oil being produced in Iraq is through Chinese companies going to Chinese markets.  Paid for with Chinese money.  Not stolen by the USA to be given to the Chinese.

You might try understanding what this table shows:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Iraq#2009_Oil_services_contracts

The gist of all those numbers is that huge mountains of money are going to the Iraqis from more than a dozen countries.  Foreign companies get a contract from the Iraq government, the companies come in and do all the construction, extraction, transport work.  The Iraqis just sit back and let the money roll in.  And no one begrudges them that.  You should at least acknowledge that.

We didn't steal anything.  Quite the opposite.  The USA was unbelievably generous when it came to Iraqi oil.