Onlinehumidor.com

[quote author=mk05 link=topic=11669.msg72841#msg72841 date=1340421707]

So wkoti, you had a bad experience that never transpired; you did your due diligence and thought better of it on the basis that you believed him to be a gouger - nevertheless the actuality of that statement - it doesn't exactly translate into him being a fake seller. For all you know, the cigars could very well just be wonky looking authentics.

Just a thought.
[/quote]

I respect your thoughts and will answer your concerns sincerely and tactfully.

Like I stated I have never seen the cigars in person, but someone such as Gary who has been around cigars for many many years, and smoked thousands upon thousands of cigars, believed them to be suspicious, that makes them suspect. No the man is not God, and I don't know him well enough at this moment to dive on a grenade for him, but I will consider his findings until they are proven wrong. As for mcgoospot selling fakes, I never bought his price increased cigars and I will never, but being aware of the business I've seen him conduct, I wouldn't put it passed him. I don't really give two hoots about ratings and so forth, I base my decisions off of personal encounters with people and he had more than questionable business practices. But I am going to try to work out a deal to acquire some these questionable cigars, at which point I can do the analysis myself and make my own documented conclusions. I don't at this moment have concrete evidence to support him selling fakes and won't until which time I acquire some of the questionable cigars, like stated above, but when/if I get that evidence, he will be called out again. With that being said, there is no way 100% to prove one side or the other. With a example being; I acquire the cigars in question, I examine them and find them in my opinion to be fake, who is to know those were actual cigars sent to Gary, who's to say Gary didn't already have the fakes, and when the 6 pack from mcgoospot arrived, switched the cigars, he claimed them to be fake, at which point replacing his fakes with authentic cigars and sending the fakes back for a refund. IN NO WAY AM I CLAIMING THIS HAPPENED OR WOULD. But the fact of the matter still stands, in no certainty will we ever 100% prove or disprove this, but merely make a decision on the preponderance of evidence. It leaves a grey area, but like most everyone put on the scumbag list, decisions and findings were based on the supporting evidence, as well as the honor and creditability of those involved.

To rephrase or clear up what I typed, this statement was made and maybe was taken differently then I had originally intended it to be read.

[i]"I personally haven't seen the cigars or any evidence, but because you were a shithead dealer with me, I don't care if he made this shit up, you are still guilty of being an asshat!"[/i]

I haven't personally had the cigars in my hand, so I merely base my statements off of what I told. But because the business he attempted to do with me, regardless of the authenticity of the cigars, or claims made, I still think mcgoospot is an asshat, due to his business I've witnessed first hand.

Well wkoti, I don't know you or know that I know you. BUT I do know Gary pretty well and yes I would jump on a grenade for him. He is a big enough man , in stature and mouth, to defend himself. two separate points to be made. 1) Mcgoospot sells a lot of cigars, yes he does , his right and everyone else has the right to not buy. I haven't because I have my own sources and dont need to pay a premium 2) accusations of selling fakes is much more significant. Without proof its useless and wrong.

Gary do me a favor and either outright make the accusation, and honestly I would think that would hold a lot more weight than innuendos. And WTF are you buying 6 cigars. Call me up, we order and split a box, done deal bitch!!!

If Gary really thought that they were fakes he would have taken my offer and returned them. I have made this offer numerous times. I buy all my cigars from PE, COH, Staggs, DG, or other reputable vendors. Look at my sales. Show me one instance where my prices have been more than PE's per cigar price. I buy a ton of cigars and sell off parts. It allows me to try stuff. It also allows people to buy fivers, ten packs and yes sometimes full boxes at great prices. Gary's claim that three different ring gauges in six cigars from a cab of CoRos does not in anyway surprise me. I just went through a box of 2011 CoRos and measured them in my ring gauge machine. Supposed to be 50 ring gauge cigars. Only nine made it through the 50 ring slot. Is my box fake? Not unless someone at the LCDH that sold them to me is somehow opening the boxes and inserting fakes and reselling them..

As for mkoti and his statement that he will try to procure these cigars and do his own test to see if they are fake why would anyone believe that you could tell the difference? Keep looking for the "fakes". The fact that you would allege that I sell fakes without any proof whatsoever and without anyone else EVER claiming that I did in hundreds if not thousands of sales and trades over 15 years says alot about your credibility. I am done with you.

It's interesting that this thread was dead for 6 months. I assume the ring gauges on the Cigars in question stayed consistent. The seller and buyer have  communicated. Seller offered refund..6 months ago.  Apparently buyer declined. Buyer didn't call out seller 6 months ago. Didn't call him out a few days ago when he resurrected this thread. Seller had to call himself out.

Seller has stellar reputation. Buyer has stellar reputation.  Given that this is a one off...why doesn't buyer handle privately? Why the innuendo 6 months ago and then again in the last few days?

Does the buyer have an agenda here..passed this transaction? Absolutely as none of this makes sense.

This thread is more about the Grateful 1 and his agenda/status as he sees it...not the cigars in question.

Taking a shot at ones reputation...a BOTL that's been around for years in this manner is irresponsible and borderline slanderous....especially giving your coyness. You have smoked thousands of cigars....post the photos..dissect those COROS...

Put up or shut up!!!

I was originally buying six smokes from a box. Not 6 from two different boxes that were not even in hand.
When they arrived I immediately contacted Mike to ask about them. After a few emails it came out that they were from two different boxes. I was also waiting on RASS...those too were not in hand(that part of the deal got cancelled). The OP was posted to gather more info on what others came across.

So, to the cigars:
I would not sell them or trade them as I think they are fake.
Unless someone who see's them tells me otherwise....and a few folks have seen them, I cannot call them legit.
The reason I picked these up was that I just ran thru a newer box and wanted more. That box was consistent.

I also would not send them back to have someone else get them.

Mike...15 years of selling cigars and you ship a batch with this much disparity...that just doesn't make sense. You had to have noticed a differnece or just decided it wasn't that important.
[url=http://s87.photobucket.com/albums/k134/grateful1_2006/Cigar%20Bands/]http://s87.photobucket.com/albums/k134/grateful1_2006/Cigar%20Bands/[/url]

[quote author=smll2 link=topic=11669.msg72877#msg72877 date=1340505446]
It's interesting that this thread was dead for 6 months. I assume the ring gauges on the Cigars in question stayed consistent. The seller and buyer have  communicated. Seller offered refund..6 months ago.  Apparently buyer declined. Buyer didn't call out seller 6 months ago. Didn't call him out a few days ago when he resurrected this thread. Seller had to call himself out.

Seller has stellar reputation. Buyer has stellar reputation.  Given that this is a one off...why doesn't buyer handle privately? Why the innuendo 6 months ago and then again in the last few days?

Does the buyer have an agenda here..passed this transaction? Absolutely as none of this makes sense.

This thread is more about the Grateful 1 and his agenda/status as he sees it...not the cigars in question.

Taking a shot at ones reputation...a BOTL that's been around for years in this manner is irresponsible and borderline slanderous....especially giving your coyness. You have smoked thousands of cigars....post the photos..dissect those COROS...

Put up or shut up!!!

[/quote]

The thread was started without Mike ever being mentioned. At the time I was gathering information on what people thought.
As you see, after it was brought up...I responded.

You good now?


Edit to add....the above photo shows 10+ dots on the left and 8 on the right...I have another stick from the 5 left that has 7 ots!

That's significant.

[quote author=grateful1 link=topic=11669.msg72879#msg72879 date=1340506259]
The thread was started without Mike ever being mentioned. At the time I was gathering information on what people thought.
As you see, after it was brought up...I responded.

You good now?


Edit to add....the above photo shows 10+ dots on the left and 8 on the right...I have another stick from the 5 left that has 7 ots!

That's significant.
[/quote]


I commented on your frist post this evening as follows:

was originally buying six smokes from a box. Not 6 from two different boxes that were not even in hand.  (YOU NEED  TO BE MORE SPECIFIC.. YEAR AND BOX CODE YOU WERE LOOKING FOR?
When they arrived I immediately contacted Mike to ask about them. After a few emails it came out that they were from two different boxes. I was also waiting on RASS...those too were not in hand(that part of the deal got cancelled). The OP was posted to gather more info on what others came across.

So, to the cigars:
I would not sell them or trade them as I think they are fake (YOU NEED TO SHOW PHOTOS OF YOUR 6 CIGARS LINED UP)
Unless someone who see's them tells me otherwise....and a few folks have seen them, I cannot call them legit. (SO YOU DON’T KNOW THAT THESE ARE FAKE BUT YOU ARE ACCUSING SOMEONE OF SELLING FAKES AND YOUR NOT SURE? WOW)
The reason I picked these up was that I just ran thru a newer box and wanted more. That box was consistent.

I also would not send them back to have someone else get them.  (YEP…AFTER SHIPPING ET ALL HE’S GOING OT MAKE $23 ON THIS DEAL)

Mike...15 years of selling cigars and you ship a batch with this much disparity...that just doesn't make sense. You had to have noticed a differnece or just decided it wasn't that important.  (YOU NEED MORE PHOTOS….YOU SAID YOU HAD SIX CIGARS. YOU SHOW ONLY TWO. WHATS THAT ABOUT?)
[url=http://s87.photobucket.com/albums/k134/grateful1_2006/Cigar%20Bands/]http://s87.photobucket.com/albums/k134/grateful1_2006/Cigar%20Bands/[/url]

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________-

I am not a CC expert...just a lover of CC's. Maybe my software doesn't show what others see with your photo website. More importantly you stated you would not send the COROS back to Mike fearing him selling them to guys like me...Thanks LOL.

If that is the case...by not reporting this from day 1...you being an expert you allowed him to sell how many countless fake cigars to others with your scilence over the past 6 months. Fake bands are so simple to see. Are you kidding me?..I'm.not saying these are fake cuz I don't know...apparently you do..

You also never mentioned bannds as an issue until now. You were all about ring gauge. WTF are you doing here. You are everywhere but direct or focused.

IMO you have lossed all credibility on this issue. I don' know you. I know your reputation...which is excellent but you have lossed me. 


Seems like a wtichhunt to me. Alterior motive. I'm not buying what your selling at all...


The stats of limitations on this deal expired when you didn't handle for yourself and all from day 1..not that you have a responsiblity for the rest of us. Just going with your rep.

Mike's original sale was for6 cigars from a box split.

As for not commenting ...I posted in his TC that there was a concern. Without more infrmation I waited to get feedback from folks.
As he's been selling for 15 years and has has a good reputaion....I gathered information on the sticks and the disparity. Having revisted this and these smokes I then posted.

Do I think they are fake...yes. Do I have facts to say they were sold knowingly...no.

I never claimed to be an expert...I posted asking for feedback on such a discrepency.

I have 5 cigars as I smoked one when I first got the sticks.

As for your last line...the bands show the ring gauge difference.

Now that the point has been made, is there anything else you want to ask to deflect the point?

Is it normal to have that much of a disparity in ring gauge?

[quote author=grateful1 link=topic=11669.msg72883#msg72883 date=1340509741]
Mike's original sale was for6 cigars from a box split.

As for not commenting ...I posted in his TC that there was a concern. Without more infrmation I waited to get feedback from folks.
As he's been selling for 15 years and has has a good reputaion....I gathered information on the sticks and the disparity. Having revisted this and these smokes I then posted.

Do I think they are fake...yes. Do I have facts to say they were sold knowingly...no.

I never claimed to be an expert...I posted asking for feedback on such a discrepency.

I have 5 cigars as I smoked one when I first got the sticks.

As for your last line...the bands show the ring gauge difference.

Now that the point has been made, is there anything else you want to ask to deflect the point?

Is it normal to have that much of a disparity in ring gauge?


[/quote]

I stand by my observations. I have bands fall off cigars from time to time. Sometimes I need a blowtorch to remove them. Post photos of all five cigars left for God's sake. The SIX MONTH delay really hurts/kills your case. You needed 6 months to investigate? No. alterior motive..most likely. And your post about the dots? Are the bands fake or not...you suggested they were. WTH are you coming from? Do you have mod privileges on this site.....because when i went to sign in after my most recent post post dinner..I was locked out...and my IP address had to be confirmed.....

Hmmmm...I like in Pasadena California...have done two deals with Mike...none for at least 1.5 years or so. The deals I did do went according to Hoyle....maybe it's common knowledge...are you a moderator on this site? The signing in process was unusual.

MAYBE THE PARANOIA is contagious?

Goodnight Mr. Gary.

Unless my vendors are now selling fakes these cigars, like every cigar i own and have bought, are legit. PE, COH, STAGGS, etc...  These were from PE. I TRUST THEM IMPLICITLY. I have been a client of Rolfs for 15 years. He and i have much more than a vendor/vendee relationship. I have no doubt that the cigars are real. Send the five back and i will send you the full purchase price for the six. What is odd is the one you smoked. Never a mention that it tasted like a fake. I have 15 boxes of CoRos. I know what they should taste like. If you want replacement cigars instead let me know. I guarantee i won't sell any CoRos for a year and will smoke the ones you return immediatly upon their return to avoid any issue with my credibility.  Come on Gary. What more can i do???