Re: What El Prez said
Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 7:09 pm
I too have been following that thread. (Full disclosure. I'm a mod on FOH and I've made several purchases from JO in the past. And before you ask, I don't go back to Rob with intel that people are being mean to him on OLH) He knows he has is detractors and I really DGAF to play that game. He's a grown man and can handle himself.
As with war, the first casualty of Cuban Cigar knowledge, is the truth.
I've had the pleasure of touring El Laguito back in 2012 on my first trip to Havana. What I observed is the following. Those of us who trailed behind on the tour would hear a quick whistle or smoochy sound from a roller or two to get our attention. And once our attention was had, the rollers or other staff would hold up a 25 count wheel of unbanded BHK56's. That's what was being rolled that day. El Laguito's rolling area isn't huge so it's not unrealistic for them to focus on one cigar/vitola until they're done and move on to the next. In contrast, the La Corona Factory is huge and has different cigars being rolled daily.
Those BHK56 bundles were being offered up at 75CUC. We were asked as a courtesy by our guide/host not to indulge. So we didn't. However, there were some Germans on our tour, that decided to go for it and starting stuffing napsacks, camera bags, etc with BHK56 bundles. So, to say that legit stock couldn't come out of El Laguito, let alone any other factory, is IMO and based on my direct observations; very possible. Could that stock have been brought in from outside and dished out via EL? Very possible too. There are so many variables at play and you will never get to the truth. Interesting side note. On our tour, we got to take a quick peek into a room where there were shelves of banded cigars just sitting there of great interest. Mainly stuff that were made for various Habanos Books, such as Cohiba Sublimes Extra, large Hoyos, Monte A's, CGR's and even some bundles of 25 Anniversary Cohiba vitolas. Naturally, our eyes popped out and the only answer we got was that typically, more was rolled than what was needed or production #'s were cut back. There's was also various sticks with the green Palma Royal band (sic?)
Can JO arrange the same thing? Possible. I will add though, that what he was offering years ago, had no ties to EL. Maybe to Santos and other rollers, but it was always assumed he hit up the farms for his stock. Only he can confirm of course.
But I digress. My point is that Havana is full of interesting things and tall tales. A lot of folks in this hobby like to feel they are "in" on things. I did too for a while and came to realize, it's all a big game to gain favour at the time from visitors. What was real or not really became blurry. People I felt were something, were in fact something else. Good and or bad.
With JO's offerings, all I can say is this. I've ordered many bundles from him. He's done some cool stuff for me to spec which I really appreciated. What they really are I will truly never know. I just hope that they are at least made with Cuban tobacco 100% through. To my nose and taste buds, I don't pick up any NC flavours and aromas. So, I'm OK with that. If he is marketing his stuff as EL based, I have no evidence to the contrary. I do find it odd that given the recent years of tobacco shortages that any slippage of stock is possible. We've all seen how Habanos products have changed as a result. Lack of proper leaf has led to serious reductions in Cohiba stock, BHK's and most new releases are those damn short robustos! If his stuff really isn't from EL I hope he wouldn't present it that way. His stuff sold regardless. At the end of the day, if you're happy with your cigar, that should be the end of it. If provenance is important to you, prepare to be duped somewhere along the line. There are lots of "experts" online that think they have the inside track on all things Cuban cigars. If there's one thing I've learned, is that Cuban people are very crafty and make for great sales people. What you believe, is up to you. What is the truth? Is an entirely different matter.
my 2c
Bundwallah
As with war, the first casualty of Cuban Cigar knowledge, is the truth.
I've had the pleasure of touring El Laguito back in 2012 on my first trip to Havana. What I observed is the following. Those of us who trailed behind on the tour would hear a quick whistle or smoochy sound from a roller or two to get our attention. And once our attention was had, the rollers or other staff would hold up a 25 count wheel of unbanded BHK56's. That's what was being rolled that day. El Laguito's rolling area isn't huge so it's not unrealistic for them to focus on one cigar/vitola until they're done and move on to the next. In contrast, the La Corona Factory is huge and has different cigars being rolled daily.
Those BHK56 bundles were being offered up at 75CUC. We were asked as a courtesy by our guide/host not to indulge. So we didn't. However, there were some Germans on our tour, that decided to go for it and starting stuffing napsacks, camera bags, etc with BHK56 bundles. So, to say that legit stock couldn't come out of El Laguito, let alone any other factory, is IMO and based on my direct observations; very possible. Could that stock have been brought in from outside and dished out via EL? Very possible too. There are so many variables at play and you will never get to the truth. Interesting side note. On our tour, we got to take a quick peek into a room where there were shelves of banded cigars just sitting there of great interest. Mainly stuff that were made for various Habanos Books, such as Cohiba Sublimes Extra, large Hoyos, Monte A's, CGR's and even some bundles of 25 Anniversary Cohiba vitolas. Naturally, our eyes popped out and the only answer we got was that typically, more was rolled than what was needed or production #'s were cut back. There's was also various sticks with the green Palma Royal band (sic?)
Can JO arrange the same thing? Possible. I will add though, that what he was offering years ago, had no ties to EL. Maybe to Santos and other rollers, but it was always assumed he hit up the farms for his stock. Only he can confirm of course.
But I digress. My point is that Havana is full of interesting things and tall tales. A lot of folks in this hobby like to feel they are "in" on things. I did too for a while and came to realize, it's all a big game to gain favour at the time from visitors. What was real or not really became blurry. People I felt were something, were in fact something else. Good and or bad.
With JO's offerings, all I can say is this. I've ordered many bundles from him. He's done some cool stuff for me to spec which I really appreciated. What they really are I will truly never know. I just hope that they are at least made with Cuban tobacco 100% through. To my nose and taste buds, I don't pick up any NC flavours and aromas. So, I'm OK with that. If he is marketing his stuff as EL based, I have no evidence to the contrary. I do find it odd that given the recent years of tobacco shortages that any slippage of stock is possible. We've all seen how Habanos products have changed as a result. Lack of proper leaf has led to serious reductions in Cohiba stock, BHK's and most new releases are those damn short robustos! If his stuff really isn't from EL I hope he wouldn't present it that way. His stuff sold regardless. At the end of the day, if you're happy with your cigar, that should be the end of it. If provenance is important to you, prepare to be duped somewhere along the line. There are lots of "experts" online that think they have the inside track on all things Cuban cigars. If there's one thing I've learned, is that Cuban people are very crafty and make for great sales people. What you believe, is up to you. What is the truth? Is an entirely different matter.
my 2c
Bundwallah